Dennis Robinson Family

[mink]

I have spent much of the evening [nothing much else happening] trying to get some insight into the mystery of the "Robinson" and "Robinette" connection to the Mooers [aka "the Cousins] and I think the following site may have part of the solution. I quote the poster so as to comment on what she says:

genforum.genealogy.com/turpin/messages/1017.html


"The 1850 US Census shows the household of a blacksmith, Joseph Robinette (age 50), and his wife Cecelia (36) in Mendota, Dakota, Minnesota. Genealogist MK Smith reports that this Cecelia is Jane Kilkool's mother, Cecilia (nee Turpin) Kilkool Robinette. Cecilia is apparently in a second marriage. Joseph Robinette is Jane's stepfather.

Below Cecilia in the census is listed a Jane Robinson (age 21). MK Smith reports that this is Jane (nee Kilkool) Robert, Cecilia's daughter from her marriage with Michael Kilkool. Jane is a young widow. Her actual age is more likely in the teens and could be as young as 15. Jane had been married to Francis Robert, brother of Captain Louis Robert - one of the original proprietors of St. Paul. The two were married on 2 January 1849 at St. Paul's Chapel, and Joseph Robinette was one of the witnesses at the wedding. One of the two records of this marriage lists Francis Robert as Francois Robinson. Francis Robert died on 27 September 1849."

Mink says: So now we encounter an additional problem, a man whose actual surname was "Robert" [French] recorded as "Robinson" [definitely not French] on his own marriage record !! Even though it does not explain the "Samuel Robinson", *cousin* living in the household of John Mooers, as Samuel Robinson was too young even to be a posthumous child of Francois Robert--it only further serves to show that "Robinson" was not mixed up only with "Robertson", as it was in one census. In other words, we cannot trust that Samuel Robinson, the cousin, even actually bore that surname.
Listed below Jane in the census are the children in the household: Joseph, Jr. (age 16), Vancoise (11), Henriette (8), Mary R. (3), and Joseph L. (2). It is not clear if Cecilia is the birth mother of the oldest children; as I will later document, she was in her first marriage until at least May, 1835 and - at that time - had three daughters under the age of 15 living. An IGI record gives the marriage of Cecile Turpin and Joseph Robinette on 6 June 1842 at St. Pierre (St. Peter's Church) & St. Paul, Mendota."

Mink says: The answer seems to be that Joseph Robinette Sr., blacksmith, formerly of Prairie du Chien, was known to have come to St. Peter's around 1840 and was, at first, allied with a native woman.

" IGI records show the following children are theirs: Marie, Christened 9 August 1840, St. Pierre & St. Paul; Emelie Mathilde, C. 24 January 1841, St. Pierres; Henriette Elisabeth, C. 13 November 1842, St. Pierre & St. Paul; Helene, C. 28 July 1844, St. Pierre & St. Paul; Henri, C. 23 December 1845, St. Pierre & St. Paul; and Louis Amable, C. 26 August 1850, St. Pierre & St. Paul."

Mink says: But Joseph, Jr. seems to have been the son of the native woman. Jane Robert later married Joseph Coursolle in 1852. At any rate, I feel the connection of Theodore Robinette [probably a descendant of Joseph Sr.] to John Mooers or his wife, Marie or Mary, must be that native woman with whom Joseph Sr. had Joseph Robinette Jr. Even though I have read so many handwritten documents by Father Lucien Galtier [and his writing is very difficult], I cannot make out how old Joseph Jr, was when he was baptised in 1842. Not all those baptised in those days were babies, because no resident priest had come to St. Peter's intil 1840.

[hermin1]

That 1850 Territorial Census lists Joseph Robinette age 50 b. Can
Cecelia age 36 b. Minn.
dau. henrietta age 8 b. Minn.
son Joseph Jr. ag 16 b. Minn
son Joseph L. age 2
dau. Mary R. age 3 b. Minn.
and it does also include Cecelia's daughter jane(she lis widow).

[hermin1]

question: What is your reference for M.K. smith?
You refer to a Samuel in the household of Hazen Moores. are you referring to a census, and if so, what year and where?
jane Kilcool's first spouse,Francis robert died 2 Jan. 1849MN. he was the grother of Captain Louis robert, native of MO.
jane's sister Genevieve was first wed to Joseph coursolleII, they wed 23 Feb. 1852, Mendota ,MN Terr. Jane was Joseph's II second spouse.
___________
correction: it was Jane Kilcool who wed Joseph Kabupi coursolle on 23 Feb. 1852. Joseph married her sister Genevieve first.I can't find a marriage record for his marriage to Genevieve, so he may have wed her Ind. cust.

__________
Correction: mink, I too have those notes from that website. Please disregard my questyion re. MK Smith.

[hermin1]

Re. your theory re. a connection between theodore robinette to John Mooers or John's wife mary is that Indian woman, does not hold water. where is your documentation?
Joseph Robinette ,Jr.'s father was Joseph Robinette the blacksmith and an Indian woman.
_________
Update: please see page 6 of this thread re. theodore's connection to John moores or his wife.

[mink]

Theodore Robinette is listed in the census as an Indian living with John Mooers and so is Samuel Robinson/Robertson. The relationship given to either the head of household or his wife is "cousin" for both. John Mooer's mother was a native woman and John Mooer's wife, Mary, is who? I feel she was born too late to be a daughter of Dennis Robinson. Regardless, if there are two men listed as "Indians" living in John Mooer's household and they really are cousins , why do you feel they cannot be related to John Mooer's Indian mother.

[madrock]

Mar 5, 2012 18:01:42 GMT -5 @mink said:

Theodore Robinette is listed in the census as an Indian living with John Mooers and so is Samuel Robinson/Robertson. The relationship given to either the head of household or his wife is "cousin" for both. John Mooer's mother was a native woman and John Mooer's wife, Mary, is who? I feel she was born too late to be a daughter of Dennis Robinson. Regardless, if there are two men listed as "Indians" living in John Mooer's household and they really are cousins , why do you feel they cannot be related to John Mooer's Indian mother?

I have John Mooers wife as Ann Robinson (abt 1840 - ??).
She married John Moores (abt 1826-1899) on [unknown]
Ann's birth year determined from her age listed as 30 on the 1870 federal census. Her death year is [unknown].
John's birth year determined from his age listed as 46 on the 1870 Federal census would be 1824. But "Through Dakota Eyes", p216 states he was born in 1826. His death date in "Through Dakota Eyes", p216 is listed as Jan 1, 1899.
_madRock: Don't feel bad, the biobraphy on Hazen Moores that I found in a newsletter,on-line says John Mooers was born 1822.

[madrock]

I'm going to make a temporary halt to posting more on Dennis Robinson. My eyes are giving me fits and I need to sort though all the posts to this thread at a slower pace. Hopefully in a few days I can get it all together and post a mini family history when I'm done.

[hermin1]

Again, I ask mink, what census and what is the year that shows the robinette and samuel robertson living with John Moores. ( I stand corrected, please delete the first sentence)Hazen was married more than once. His second spouse was Martgaret Grey Cloud Woman. Oneof her kids with Capt. Anderson(first spouse) was Jane anderson. Jane and John Mooers would thus be step sibs. Jane married Andrew Robertson. One of their children was Thomas A Robertson. Thomas had a son Samuel which would make him a second cousin to John Mooers.

Theodore Robinette was the child of Vanoss(sp) Noel robinette(son of Joseph robinette and Cecelia turpin) and Matillda Celine LaBatte.Joseph and Cecelia had 11 children,not counting Joseph,Jr.

(Correction) theodore robinette may be connected to John Mooers via his sister-in-law rosalia Frenier Felix. See page 6 of this thread.

[hermin1]

madrock:
John Mooers or Moore married Annie Reed on 21 Feb. 1870 at winona, Minn.(Minn. marriages 1849- 1950)..

[mink]

Hermin, I think you need to go back to previous pages of this thread. I always give my sources. I was not able to find Samuel Robertson as a son of Thomas Robertson. Where did you find the information? Please give your source. And I don't see how John Mooers can have been any kind of cousin, in reality, to anyone named Robertson when he was not even related to Jane except as a step-sister, which is not a blood relative. That was my thinking when I suggested that perhaps the relationship was through the native wives. Have you investigated that? Still, I do accept that sometimes the term "cousin" can be used quite loosely.

[mink]

Mar 6, 2012 11:51:56 GMT -5 hermin1 said:

John Mooers or Moore married Annie Reed on21 Feb. 1870 at winona, Minn.(Minn. marriages 1849- 1950

What about this?

"[footnote 8] - 1880 FEDERAL CENSUS, Minnesota, Lincoln County, Hope Township, Enumeration District No. 139, Dwelling & Family No. 23:
Moore, John, White, Male, age 56, Head of family, married, Farmer,
Place of birth MN, Father's place of birth MN, Mother's place of birth DC
Date of birth calculated as 1824
Moore, Mary, Indian, Female, age 41, Wife, married, Keeping House."

Have we got two John Moores?

[hermin1]

John Mooers was married at least twice,. First spouse was Mary?, the sister of Thomas robinson. Second wife was Rosalia Frenier.
(correction: second wife was Rose aka Nape Frenier, dau. of Francois and Mary Helen(Wyantoiciyewin) Frenier.Rose died before or after 1887 at age of over 60 yrs.

There is a John Moore, son of Oliver Moore(son of chief iron Elk's sister).Then there is Hazen Mooers son John Mooers. it is
possible the Census Taker may have misspelled John Mooers name and given it as Moores, or Moore?
Reference for Samuel Robertson being Thomas Robertson's son is the Martin-Marlow Family Tree.

[hermin1]

I have the 1880 US Census for Hope,Lincoln ,MN which l;ists:
head John Moore age 56(White),
Wife Mary Moore age 41(Indian),
Cousin Samuel Robertson age 23,
Cousin Thomas Robinson or Robertson age 20
is this the census you are talking about mink?
_________
the thomas mentioned I believe is thomas T. Robertson, son of Thomas A.Robertson and his second wife.
why the census i found don't show theodore Robinette is a puzzle to me.
but in indian custom, everyone is a cousin.

[hermin1]

Mary or Marie Moran was a mixed blood, french,cree,and dakota.
______
Update:
As I understand it she was born in Canada.

[mink]

I thought I was quoting from "Through Dakota Eyes" on page 4 of this thread with that 1880 Federal Census. Okay, Robinette or no Robinette, we have two wives of a John "Moore". One was Marie Moran and the other Ann Reed. You feel sure the cousins are called "Robertson" and I think you're right. So where is the marital connection of John Mooers to Tom Robinson, Mad Rock's ancestor? Perhaps there really is none and the statement in the book about John having married a sister of Tom Robinson is in error. I am not familiar with anybody named Moran in Minnesota in those days. But there was "Morin" and we discussed this previously in maybe the Rocque family thread although I don't recall the details now. I'll take a look and see if I can find it.

[mink]

In the Rocque family thread, you supplied that "Thomas A. Robinson was.His sister was Madeline, your distant ancestor.Thomas married several times:
1. Mary Jane Wakute aka Wagiwin(d/o Chief Wakute)
2. Mary Moran a mixed blood(Cree and French)"
____________
Re. Mary Moran,I wrote French,Cree and Dakota

[mink]

Oh--BTW, Hermin, you also mentioned in the Rocque thread that Thomas A. Robinson had a second daughter named Mary. Would you happen to know what happened to her or whom she married?

[mink]

I don't know why I don't think of this stuff all at once so as not to make so many posts but--just pointing out--the 1880 census has this Mary, wife of Moore, being age 41. That equals an 1839 birthdate, even though I don't have so much faith in these census ages. It doesn't look to me like she could be a daughter of Tom Robinson if she was that old--and is not old enough, IMO, to have been a daughter of Dennis Robinson. So we are back to sqaure 1 with this Mary.

[mink]

Never mind, Hermin. Checking back yet again, I did see where you gave the info on Tom Robinson's daughter, Mary, and whom she married. Evidently someone named Stoops. Also, I noticed something else in one of Mad Rock's previous posts and I quote him:

"[footnote 1] - THROUGH DAKOTA EYES - Narrative Accounts of the Minnesota Indian War of 1862, Edited by Garry Clayton Anderson / Alan R. Woolworth, Endnote 10, page 216:
John Moores was the son of Hazen Mooers, a trader, and a Dakota woman. He was born in 1826 near Red Wing's village at the mouth of the Cannon River and lived there with his mother until he was about fifteen years old. He then joined his father and learned about the fur trade. They moved to the Redwood Agency in 1853, and by 1855 John was clerking for James W. Lynd. He was active in the war proteching the captives and spent the winter of 1862-1863 in the Dakota camp at Fort Snelling. After scouting for the army, 1863-67, he settled on a claim in Lincoln County and married a sister of Thomas Robinson's. He died on January 1, 1899.Sources: A. E. Tasker, "Early History of Lincoln County (Lake Benton, Minn, - Lake Benton News Print, 1936, reprinted 1973) at p.294 & "Tyler Journal", January 6, 1899"

According to this, John Mooers did not marry that "sister of Thomas Robinson" after he left the army in 1867. According to Hermin a John Moore married Annie Reed in 1870. When did he marry Mary, then? Something wrong here. And where is Lincoln County in relationship to Winona, MN? Should check that out.
___________________
Read your posting again(see bold lettering).
i don't see anything wrong. LDS Archives in their Minnesota marriages 1849- 1950 lists the marriage record of a John Moore to Annie Reed in 1870, Winona,MN.I do not know if this is John Mooers or John Moore(son of Oliver Moore) who married this Annie Reed.
______________
mary Louise was also married to Samuel bluestone, son of John Bluestone..

[mink]

Winona and Lincoln Counties are on the opposite sides of the state in southern Minnesota. Lincoln County is in the vicinity of the Lake Traverse area. My head is spinning? A different John Moore living in Winona County? Back to the census.