Rocque Family - Wabasha MN & Prairie du Chien WI

[madrock]

Jan 31, 2012 12:13:17 GMT -5 @mink said:

Today I was reading the memoirs of Mrs. Baird, the sister of Jane Rolette [later Jane Dousman] and unexpectedly came across this reference to Theophilus Lachapelle:

"After supper we had a call from Theophile la Chappelle, brother of the first Mrs. Mitchell. He was a member of the legislature, a bright and intellectual young man, and an agreeable talker. His sister, Mrs. Mitchell, had died the December previous, and his desire to see me was great, knowing the friendship that existed between her and myself. Poor young man! He became insane soon after this, and spent the remainder of his life at the Hospital for the Insane, near Madison."

Another source said Mendota was the site of the hospital, but I knew that was not possible.

The biggest of the lakes surrounding Madison, WI is Lake Mendota (northwest side). Could explain why the other source was referring to the asylum being at Mendota.

Added later: Mendota Mental Health Institute, formerly known as Mendota State Hospital, is a psychiatric hospital located in Madison, Wisconsin north of Lake Mendota. Opened July 14, 1860, it was the first mental hospital in Wisconsin. (wikipeidia)

[mink]

That explains a lot! However, Theophilus Lachapelle had to be transferred there from somewhere else if the hospital didn't open until 1860. The murder occurred in 1849 and the trial where Lachapelle was deemed innocent by reason of insanity soon afterward.

[mink]

I was re-reading Featherstonhaugh [ a name supposedly pronounced "Fanshaw"] this morning and came across mention of another fair-haired mixed blood girl living with Joseph Renville's family at Lac Qui Parle:

"Having eaten as many potatoes as I had a fancy for, I tried one or two more with the maple sugar, by way of a dessert, without being at all sorry for it afterwards; and the fair-haired young girl being in the room, I asked some questions about her father, who, I learnt, was a Scotch trader, of the name of Jeffrey. He had died and was buried there, leaving four young children he had by a Nahcotah woman, of which this girl was the eldest."

Anybody ever see anything about this Jeffrey or what happened to his children?

[hermin1]

yes i know who you are talking about.the trader's name was either John or Joseph Jeffries( Ihad a hard time reading the affidavit), and one of his daughters was named Mary(b.@1822), and his wife was Winona Zidan. His wife's parents were Miniapi and Kutepi, uncle of chief Inyangmani, head of the Wahpetons before 1862. Mary wed Henry Belland another trader. I believe Nancy Jeffries(she married alexander R. mcCleod), was one of Mary's siblings, as was Betsy Jeffries(bapt. Feb. 25, 1838 Lac Qui Parle).
I don't know about the other child.My photographic memory keeps giving me the name Angelique, for some reason.

I found some more information from the Half Breed Land Scrips affidavits:
#19 Pierre lariviere swore his mother was Catherine Rock, niece of Charles LaPointe's mother, and is a dau. of Augustin Rock.
#21 Joseph Rock swore that hisis a son of Augustin Rock, a 1/2 breed. His mother is !/2 Sac and 1/2 Mdewakanton.
#33 Batiste Rock swore that he is Augustin Rock's son and is a bro. to Louis and Josewph Rock. Batiste's wife is mary Frazier, dau. of Joseph Jack Frazier.
#32 augustin Rock mentions his sons, and daughter Catherine, who was wed to 1) Michell lariviere,and 2) Francois LaPointe.
#86 James Reed swore that he married Ariens(sp.) laBathe, on 7 Oct. 1844. she was the dau./of a Frenchman Labathe,and her mother was a sister of Chief Wabasha. Her prior spouses were #1 Joseph Barnet, 2) Amiable Grignon by whom she has 3 children.
#98 Mary Louise martin,swore that she was once the wife of theophilus Lachapelle, sibling of Pelagie Brisbois( he was the one who went insane)now dec'd. and that she had remarried to Hypolite Martin.given that the affidavits were filed between 1855-1857, this means that Theophilus died before 1857.
_____________________
Correction:her affidavit was #99, and she Affirmed that her husband is Hypolite Martin. Her first spouse was Pierre LaChapelle now dead,son of Pelagie LaChapelle, by whom she has 5 children.
Boy did I really mis copy from that affidavit.
I went bleary eyed from trying to make out what was written on most of these affidavits.

[mink]

Hermin, in the meantime I was doing a quick Google and came upon an old "Renville" thread from this board [2007] where it stated that Angelique had married a William Quinn:

"QUINN, WILLIAM L. - Born in 1829 in Minnesota. A clerk in St. Paul in 1850. Living in his household in 1850 was Angelique (1829 MN). [MN50]

www.lareau.org/pep-q.html

www.lareau.org/pep.html
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Re: RENVILLE
Post by nncy58 on Feb 26, 2007, 12:17am

Yes the William L Quinn married to Angelique Jeffries(Gerfres,Jeffery have seen it all these ways) was the son of Peter Quinn from Ireland. He was the interpreter that was killed at Redwoods Ferry with Capt Marsh on Aug 18 1862. He was married to Marie Finley(Findlay) Louise Boucher and/or Ineyahewin who were all full bloods I believe. I was trying to see if Thomas Quinn was William and Anglique's son but according to the story their Thomas died around 1873 and our Thomas was born 1860/1861 and married 1881. The only other possibility I see is if Thomas could have been a son of Peter. There is a census that shows Peter Louise and Thomas and the ages are about right. Maybe???"

I don't know the others mentioned, but is it possible to read the entire Renville thread?

[mink]

This paper

collections.mnhs.org/MNHistoryMagazine/articles/22/v22i03p270-289.pdf

states that, in 1821, Joseph Renville was placed in charge of a trading post at Lake Traverse in western Minnesota and that Joseph Jeffries was his accountant there. It says that both men left the fur company that had established them at Lake Traverse but it says nothing further about what happened to Jeffries.

[hermin1]

Thomas Quinn was the son of William Quinn(Sr.). William was the son of Peter Quinn. Thomas Froze to death in the winter of 1873.(Woolworth Papers. MHs.St. Paul).

[hermin1]

The Thomas Quinn you are looking is the Thomas Quinn who was the son of Mrs. Louise Siyowin(prairie chicken) Boucher, and Peter Quinn(dec'd). She remarried to Itewakanhdiota. Thomas was born @ 1860/1861 in MN,married Jennie Cloudman in 1881 at the Goodwill Mission,SD.(Iapi Oayea/The word Carrier).

there is yet a third Thomas Quinn, who was the son of Henry Quinn, son of William Quinn Sr.

I checked my file on the Quinns and there was the documentation re. Angelique Jeffries married to William Quinn,Sr. What a reassurance that my photographic memory is still working. hahahah
___
Update
Joseph Jeffriess died and is buried at Lac Qui parle. His daughter Betsy died in 1887.

[mink]

I was quoting someone else who was interested in Thomas Quinn in the 2007 thread--but it's of interest to me, as well. I would like to figure out which Jeffries daughter was the eldest [according to Featherstonhaugh], who was about 15 years old when he saw her at Renville's place. Do you know?

[mink]

I wonder if it can be true that Theophilus LaChapelle was dead before 1860 because that was when MadRock said the Mendota Hospital opened at Madison and Theophilus spent the rest of his life there. Maybe he can confirm. I think it's possible for a Catholic to get a marriage annulment if the other party is certified insane--so perhaps Theophilus did not have to die for his wife to remarry.

[hermin1]

all I know is what the Affidavit that Mary Louise Martin made out., said. Augustion Rock even affirmed her affidavit.
Re. the ages of the Jeffries girls, hold on asnd I will check my files.

[hermin1]

Well, it is a tossup:
Betsy, when she was baptized at lac qui parle by Rev. thomas Williamson, was a widow. haven't been able to find out when she was born, let alone who she was married to.
Mary was born @ 1822, or 1813 according to one of my files.
Nancy was born 1822
Angelique was born 1828.
The Minn. Hist. Soc. has a file on Joseph jeffries and his wife Elizabeth (Winona Zee or Zedan).they are in the Alan R. Woolworth Papers. i don't hjave acces to the records. the MnHS charges a n Arm and a leg for these.

Joseph Renville had partnership also with Charles Jacques Frenier also at one time.

[mink]

Hermin, you wrote:

"#98 Mary Louise martin,swore that she was once the wife of theophilus Lachapelle, sibling of Pelagie Brisbois( he was the one who went insane)now dec'd. and that she had remarried to Hypolite Martin.given that the affidavits were filed between 1855-1857, this means that Theophilus died before 1857."

I don't recall a Pelagie Brisbois. Theophilus's sister, Therese, married Bernard W. Brisbois--so maybe she was the one who was deceased, she having died in 1849, I think. Wasn't Pelagie the mother of Theophilus Lachapelle? I will have to look over the posts on the family here. I did check on the Mendota Hospital and it really did not open until 1860.
_________
You are correct. I corrected my error re. the affidavit.I reread it: Mary Louise wrote re. her "late " husband Theophilus LaChpapelle, that he was the son of Pelagie La chapelle, not Brisbois. I apologize for my error.

[hermin1]

mink and madrock: I found the Featherstonehaugh's books about his explorations in the Upper Midwest region, and in the one about his journey upthe minesortay river, he talked about stopping at Chief Wabasha's village, and talking to his brother Anpetuwaukee.
I had seen Featherstonehaugh mentioned in other background references, and hesitated to try and get a look at his book, because one or more of the authors menitoned something abjectionable about his character and his journals.

[mink]

Featherstonhaugh is of great interest because of what he saw and whom he met. I enjoy reading him because his writing is not without humor and he noticed everything. Of course, he takes the usual superior viewpoint of the time of a person who has had a good education and is of more than average means. The Englishman is no more condescending than others of his era toward the Native Americans. Even the French priests, the missionaries, called them "les sauvages", which is a bit ironic considering they had left their own bloody revolution not too far behind. Featherstonhaugh is a creature of his time and the society that formed him but his character is not really objectionable. He never hesitated to write any of his impressions, even though not all were charitable. We cannot expect him to conform to more modern standards of political correctness because there really was no such thing in the 19th Century. People then had very different viewpoints on nearly everything compared to today.

[madrock]

mink: I've been working on two other projects the last couple days, so I'm glad you found more on the 1860 opening the the Mendota State Hospital at Madison. I lived in Trempealeau, Wisconsin 1936-1953 and I remember the way the locals (we river rats) referred to people with mental health problems being sent down to the State Mental Hospital in Madison as "They took so and so down to Mendota." Nobody said Madison. For less serious mental conditions "They took so and so up to Whitehall." meaning the Physiciatic Hospital at the Trempealeau County seat in Whitehall, Wisconsin which is north of Trempealeau.

hermin1: Those mixed-blood affidavits you have, are they from the MHS microfilm? I've been in touch with Mary Frances Ronan at National Archives and she's narrowed down from 700+ possible "Sioux Reserve" boxes to 9, where the original copies of the affidavits are contained. I've been too busy lately to zero in on a WashDC researcher to see how much it would cost for the entire set of affidavits knowing they only had to look through nine boxes. James Hansen WHS told me "The numbered affidavits cover #1-285 in 9 “booklets” plus one additional affidavit “#626”. Affidavits #17-54 were apparently taken at Wabasha in Aug. 1855;" so that may even shorten the search and copy time cost.

[madrock]

I like reading sections of Featherstonhaugh's "Canoe trip up the Minney Sotar" every so often. I even try "hearing his words" with an English accent which makes some of his pompous statements even more humorous. He's the only source that I've found so far that mention Daylight as a brother of Wapasha II. I think he dwells on him for 3-4 pages. When I was working on Swiss genealogy, notes from Julius Billeter were belittled by some "scholars" stating he wasn't very complete with some of his families and "very creative" with others. But I took what he had and was able to expand. He was a tremendous help to me. So with Featherstonhaugh meeting Daylight, I take that as a start and hope to find more.

[madrock]

Feb 11, 2012 14:09:41 GMT -5 hermin1 said:

#86 James Reed swore that he married Ariens(sp.) laBathe, on 7 Oct. 1844. she was the dau./of a Frenchman Labathe,and her mother was a sister of Chief Wabasha. Her prior spouses were #1 Joseph Barnet, 2) Amiable Grignon by whom she has 3 children.

Here's a little more on James Reed's affidavit:
No. 86 I, James Reed, of lawful age, dispose and say that I reside in Tremplau County, State of Wisconsin. That on the 7th day of October A D 1844 I married Archange Labath, who is a half breed of the Medawahkanton band of Sioux. Her father’s name was Labath, her mother was sister to Wabashaw the old Chief, father of the present Chief Wabashaw. She was married twice before I married her. First to a man named Joseph Barret. Her second husband’s name was Amable Grignon. By him she had three children, one named Antoine Grignon aged twenty-three years, Paul Grignon aged twenty one yrs, Arcange aged 17 yrs; these children reside with me & are quarter bloods of said band. The said Antoine is married to a quarter blood Winnebago. He has two children, a son & a daughter, (older a girl) Archange aged 2 yrs, Robert aged eleven months. Paul Grignon has a son & daughter, Hannah aged two years & Norbert aged seven months. The wife of Paul is a Quarter blood Ottoway. These four children are eighth bloods of said Medawahkanton band & reside with their parents. [signed on next page]

[mink]

MR, one thing I did admire about Featherstonhaugh is that he really did want to communicate with the natives and took the trouble to try to learn some of their language. His English gentleman's education included French, without knowledge of which he couldn't have gotten on too well along the Mississippi in those days. Those Englishmen of the old school evidently spoke a better French than one might imagine. I once saw a clip of Sir Anthony Eden being interviewed for French TV and was amazed at his fluency and his good accent. Also, Featherstonhaugh didn't try to exploit the Indians in any fashion--he was a geologist and not a trader. He gave away a lot of food stuffs and tobacco, according to him, although when it came to "smoking the pipe", he was at a decided disadvantage because tobacco smoke made him ill. Since he didn't find the Dakota women attractive, he let them alone, too. His narrative always perks up when he encounters a blonde, however! To each his own taste. In other words, Featherstonhaugh was the perfect white man where the NAs were concerned--generous and harmless.

[hermin1]

madrock:
No the ones I have copies of, came from the NARA in Wash. DC. james Hansen also got his information for his article on the Mixed Blood Woodland sioux 1855-1857 Census.(should be in our Archives). he said the microfilms were in such bad condition in parts, that he had to refer to several of them to get the information.