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Post by okwataga on Jul 18, 2009 9:58:08 GMT -5
There was a Henry father of Paul of White RIver
and a William who died in 9/4/1881 Ascension
And a Maggie who married Wm Baine at Fort Sisseton
if you know anything about this family please help... Thanks ____________________ questions that need to be answered before we can search: Were henry, paul, william and maggie's last names Holyface? Do you have any vital data for Maggie Holyface,or Paul Holy Face?
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Post by okwataga on Jul 20, 2009 13:21:31 GMT -5
Henry Holyface at White River baptised 12/21/1890 Miniska Paul Holyface at White River son of Henry baptised 12/21/1890 Miniska William Holyface died at Ascension Mrs Maggie Holyface married Wm Baine in 4/20/1877 at Ft Sisseton - she moved to Standing Rock and had two sons George married Anna Hill (Oneida) and John C Baine (who wrote hym with Ben White) and one daugther Sallie/ Sally who married Frank Laframboise(sp)
that is about all I have on the Holyfaces'
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Post by hermin1 on Jul 21, 2009 11:23:11 GMT -5
okwataga,thank you for the additional nformation. This will help us to help you.
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Post by okwataga on Jul 21, 2009 12:09:46 GMT -5
thanks for anything you can help me with!! I really appreciate it!! Dawn
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Post by Vicky on Jul 21, 2009 15:34:32 GMT -5
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Post by hermin1 on Jul 22, 2009 11:38:11 GMT -5
I also found a John Baine born 1878 attending the Carlisle Institute in PA in 1900. His father was listed as Jesse Baine. I found a William Baine, who died 4 Dec. 1905 in Roberts County,SD 30Jun 1891 Standing Rock Indian Census lists: maggie age49 Head of Family John Baine Age 15 son Sallie Age 15 dau. GeorgeBaine Age 11 son
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Post by Vicky on Jul 22, 2009 12:58:42 GMT -5
1891 Sisseton Wahpeton Elrod Roll lists-
Martha BAIN age 23, single, lives alone
William BAIN age 21, single, lives alone
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Post by okwataga on Jul 22, 2009 13:10:44 GMT -5
okay thanks
I have all this on the Baine side - william, martha, maggie, john, george, sallie - etc.... the laframboise(sp), crozter, tillerson, teehee.....
mostly trying to find out who Maggie was and why she is related to charles marshall, Running With (john Running with)
william and martha are and staied with sisseton and not real sure what their moms name was - while the other baines were over at standing rock....
i have copies of the different census's, some death certs...
but cannot figure anything out about Maggie Holyface
thanks everyone
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Post by okwataga on Jul 22, 2009 13:14:59 GMT -5
and I do have the info about bertha jean baine eastman and the family info for her as well... well not all the family info... but able to back up to william baine and adam littlehunder.....eve littlethunder and who all she married and what kids she had.....
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Post by Vicky on Jul 22, 2009 16:28:23 GMT -5
The only way you will find out anything about Maggie is to send off to NARA in DC for some probates for her and her children. Her marriage was too early for there to be any record, and SD didn't list the parents on their marriage records anyway. Contact DC and request info, they call them "heirships" and not "probates". They only need the names and tribal affiliation. Contact- MaryFrances.Ronan@nara.gov
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Post by Vicky on Jul 22, 2009 16:49:39 GMT -5
Her probate may even include who she was married to before Mr. Bain. I see in the Iapi that she was MRS. Maggie in 1877- HOLYFACE, MRS MAGGIE m William Bain 4-20-1877 - Fort Sisseton {v 6 # 6 p 23]
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Post by Vicky on Jul 22, 2009 16:53:52 GMT -5
Her name translates as Itecokawakanwin if anyone wants to search prior to 1877.
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Post by okwataga on Jul 23, 2009 6:19:10 GMT -5
so is she Holyface
or HolyfaceWoman?
thanks again for the NARA help
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Post by okwataga on Jul 23, 2009 6:19:56 GMT -5
so William, Paul and Henry are also Itecokawakanwin as well?
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Post by Vicky on Jul 23, 2009 8:47:07 GMT -5
Win means "woman". You will almost always find "win" at the end of a woman's name. Itecokawakanwin was her Indian name, which she may have taken as her last name at some point in time, probably when she was baptized and was given a Christian first name. Her children may have taken the last name Holy Face, but they would have dropped the "win". Last names are so interesting as I have seen children take as their last name- the maiden name of their mother, the Indian name of their father, or the first/ Christian name of their father. Maggie's children, if she married, would have the last name of the man she married, in most cases. They would all have a different Indian name though.
While NARA in DC will have the heirships you need, you might also contact NARA in KC which has records for the Central Plains Region. Just give them the names and tribes and they will look and see if they have anything. Their contact is-
kansascity.archives@nara.gov
Good luck to you!
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Post by okwataga on Jul 23, 2009 17:02:08 GMT -5
okay so it translates to holy center face woman or holyface center woman....
and she dropped the center woman off when using english? where did you find her using itecokawakanwin??
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Post by Vicky on Jul 23, 2009 17:58:36 GMT -5
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Post by okwataga on Jul 24, 2009 6:54:47 GMT -5
Itecokawakanwin
I have the Iapi Oaye copy - but it just says her name is Holyface.... Ite Wakan.... which I have seen signed on some documents just Ite Wakan....
the itecokawakanwin - is not jsut holyface - its more or less holy center face woman, so if you can show me where you foudn her using the itecokawakanwin i would appreciate it
thanks for all your help
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Post by Vicky on Jul 24, 2009 8:54:45 GMT -5
Click on the link in the post above your last one. Iapi Oaye, July 1877
If you have mention of her name being Holy Face, it may be from the Word Carrier which would be in English. Also, the transcribed listings which appear on this site, have this name translated as Holy Face.
Don't sweat the name. They were often shortened when translated. :-)
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Post by Vicky on Jul 24, 2009 9:01:20 GMT -5
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