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Post by whipple on Apr 29, 2008 18:17:37 GMT -5
Ed Meng resigns after differences concerning the Black Hills case. There has been issues and different opinions about the case and it came to a head today with Ed Meng resigning and walking out of the office. I received a phone call today and I will keep you updated.
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Post by whipple on Apr 29, 2008 21:17:38 GMT -5
All has been calmed down and Ed will be staying with the case - for now. Sorry for starting this drama - drama closed!
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Post by dgberg on May 1, 2008 21:01:56 GMT -5
this is all hogwash, just like the threats that have been cast, we have been through this before and will continue until a face has been connected with the threat. this is all hogwash, just like the threats that have been cast, we have been through this before and will continue until a face has been connected with the threat. Ed Meng resigns after differences concerning the Black Hills case. There has been issues and different opinions about the case and it came to a head today with Ed Meng resigning and walking out of the office. I received a phone call today and I will keep you updated.
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Post by dgberg on May 1, 2008 21:26:44 GMT -5
Does anyone think that we will get the Black Hills back? Tell that to the single moms that are trying to make ends meet with little or no help. tell that to the person who needs the money to follow through with his or her college dream. We should come together for a reality check. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
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Post by Curtis Kitto "MIKE" on May 1, 2008 22:01:11 GMT -5
Tell that to my Great-Grandmother who was incarcerated in the Crow Creek concentration camp. (She was a single mother too.) Or to the Mdewakantons who fought alongside Tashsunkawitco. Sell PahaSapa? In your dreams.
I have instructed my Son and Grandson NEVER to agree to selling the Black Hills, EVER.
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Post by dgberg on May 2, 2008 20:50:52 GMT -5
And what is your plan to get the Black Hills back?
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Post by dgberg on May 2, 2008 21:08:07 GMT -5
my friend that was then, this is now.
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Mathew503
Full Member
Hogantankakastaka
Posts: 98
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Post by Mathew503 on May 3, 2008 1:30:25 GMT -5
Then,now it makes no difference! ours is ours and it was stolen for the benefit of others! Taken by greed ,hatred and lies. Times are tough but thats why we have to educate our own and strive for the best of all of our people. We are all in it together !!! Family,Pride, and Respect for the people of then ,now and forever.
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Post by Curtis Kitto "MIKE" on May 3, 2008 5:58:17 GMT -5
Tahansi,
Do you own anything that you prize highly over anything or anyone in this world?
Imagine this: You are living in your home and you possess all the land around you. Then you realize that you have neighbors, so being a friendly sort, you offer your hospitality. Your neighbor, the Wasicu arrives at your home, walking into your living room, (without taking his shoes off) grabs your wife, throws her to the floor and mounts her, as he is busy, he is smiling at you, he finishes, and seeing your most prize possession, he lays hands on it and steals it. He walks back out the door.
You have no recourse, he has a gun, he is bigger than you, younger, in better shape, (you get the idea). You sit there shocked, for a moment, you too, get your gun and go after him.
He kills you.
Your son goes after him.
He kill him, too.
Then your relatives go after him, he kills them.
Years go by, your descendants know what happened to you and your family. They also know who has the prize possession. The Wasicu is peaceful, he has taken his wars back to his homeland, peace for the most part has descended upon the land, your world has become civilized.
The Wasicu, now older, comes to your relatives, mostly poor, poverty stricken, uneducated, just as he had planned all along, and says to them, "Look, I have this prize possession, if you will sell your birthright to me, I will offer you some money for it: 30 pieces of silver, sign here and the money is yours.
Of course some of the relatives will go for the offer, but the majority, knowing that the thief, murderer, rapist, imprisoner, war criminal, (you get the idea) still knows he does NOT own the land. The majority will reject the offer and stand resolute until Jesus Christ comes again.
Now which side do you stand with?
Your cousin,
MIKE
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Post by wanderer on May 3, 2008 9:52:30 GMT -5
Tahansi-- Good post! I understand those who feel that accepting the settelment is the only realistic option avialble, but I cannot bring myself to do less than my partents and grandparents did in refusing to legitimize the theft and rape of the Paha Sapah. wanderer
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Post by dgberg on May 3, 2008 20:00:07 GMT -5
The gathering went better than expected today, there were people signing up on the spot, we didnt expect that and plenty more will follow suit. Everyone, and there were many, showed nothing but support for this and there was no resistance. I was surprised to see our people from many miles away there. like i said it went better than expected and will continue. As far as your sick deranged posts i'd rather not reply, if you feel you need to write something like that on a public forum, and you get away with it, i'd rather not associate on here anymore. There are many, many people on this forum that i think very highly of and i always will.
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Post by Curtis Kitto "MIKE" on May 3, 2008 20:54:29 GMT -5
Typical Loafer.
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Mathew503
Full Member
Hogantankakastaka
Posts: 98
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Post by Mathew503 on May 4, 2008 1:19:30 GMT -5
lol
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Post by antap2 on May 4, 2008 13:52:03 GMT -5
UNITED we stand, DIVIDED we fall. Government doesn't have to do a thing except sit back, laugh and watch us destroy each other. Shame isn't it?
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Mathew503
Full Member
Hogantankakastaka
Posts: 98
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Post by Mathew503 on May 4, 2008 15:40:00 GMT -5
It is a shame! and we should stand together!!! Collect an indian welfare check to say we that give up and that we as a people have no honor for our ancestors.. That is abandonment of our heritage and disrespect to ourselves as well as our elders!!!!! And I for one am proud to be of the santee nation!!!!
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Post by hermin1 on May 4, 2008 21:13:47 GMT -5
You have a very proud and ancient heritage.
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Post by Curtis Kitto "MIKE" on May 4, 2008 22:04:24 GMT -5
This SCAM reminds me of my youth, I never received what I wanted until someone said "YES."
We Santees WILL NEVER AGREE to selling the Paha Sapa.
(OKAY, So Butch tried to a few years back, but he was unsuccessful.)
The USA stole the land from us, when they abrogated the Treaty of 1868.
NUFF' said!
Curtis Mike Kitto
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Post by santee1961 on May 4, 2008 23:41:17 GMT -5
I'm having a hard time wrapping my brain around this. I'm having difficulty grasping the concept that native people have actually attended a meeting with the opportunistic intention of receiving money for the Black Hills. I have always subscribed to the "United We Stand, Divided We Fall" philosophy and it's also the oldest trick in the book. Time as well as plain old common sense has proven those words to be a true and accurate adage. To even think about receiving payment for something priceless is beyond comprehension and belief. For the attendees to explore this for the possible advantage and benefit of a few and then attempt to use the excuse of "That was then and this is now" just doesn't cut it. I am fairly confident that since the word "payment" was mentioned it would be fairly safe to assume the motive may be comparable to a modern"Get Rich Quick" scheme. There are complex issues involved within the Black Hills topic and the Government's failure on behalf of Native People. Nonpayment for the land is only one facet of a complex and multifaceted issue. Taking into consideration the length of time the Wolfchild case has taken to get to this point, it is natural to assume the length of time an issue of this importance could very well have an even longer time frame. Who would benefit the most in a case of this nature? Legal counsel or the people? Who assumes the responsibilities of the legal fees? Would the money that has been sitting in the trust fund cloud the other issues of the treaty (treaties)? Would these issues get the attention they deserve? What about those who do not want to sell and won't take the money? We all know that history has recorded a lack of responsibility and commitment by the trustees of our Government to native people of this country. History has also shown that the primary beneficiaries always seems to be the legal counsel and the Government, not usually the people, on these cases. In the past and present our freedoms and rights have been neglected by our Trustee and we can count way too many excuses for the failures of these rights. I don't hold much hope of this pattern ever changing if we continue to do nothing about it. If we, as Indian people, all could "Unite" we would have a better chance of accomplishing some goals. Obviously our Trustee, the Government's would like us to settle this issue. I wonder who exactly or what has prompted the interest in this matter among the native people at this time? An issue such as this with a magnitude of importance requires the commitment and the unity of all our native people. If this can't be unanimously attained then this is not the time for this matter. Remember the saying goes, "UNITED WE STAND OR DIVIDED WE FALL (NOT THEY)". We all need to consider this issue very carefully. I for one, will not accept a glib reply of "That was then, this is now". As far as loafer mentality...there are plenty historical books describing this way of life that some Indians assumed and how it affected the Indians who hung around the forts. Their way of life changed and there was not much done for the family by the man in the way of traditionally providing for his family. Lack of commitment and lack of dependability for the family became common and the family suffered a great deal from the loss of these customs from hanging around the Fort ,as it were. Men went from being free to carry on their responsibilities and could go wherever they needed in order to provide and protect his family. I'm sure that the families and especially the men surely suffered a loss of their pride, humiliation while at the Fort when they were no longer able to provide for their family like they were able to do once. I, myself, will not consider "selling" the Black Hills. My family agrees with Mike and others who have taken the position that the Black Hills are not for sale. Please, Please, Please let's Unite and send a message that the BLACK HILLS are not for sale. I do not believe "THAT WAS THEN ~ THIS IS NOW" reason is an ethical reason to begin a process. Can they also guarantee that they will not take advantage of Indian people and can they guarantee to not take advantage of the condition of the economic conditions? A pretext that only promises the appearance of a commitment to helping the Indian people . If that doesn't work as it should then it could be devastating to everyone. After the lawyers got done...how much would be be entitled fto after they get their cut? The reservation system or the Tribal Government, for example. works like this. It is not a successful model example of Government who practicies balanced business management with the native people's best interests at heart. For this process to work there cannot be room for doubts, I have lots of questions that I would like to get answers because I have lots of doubts and questions. I guess we will find out what will happen. Well sorry for this long posts but I won't sell the Black Hills. We could ask if they would sell St. Peter's Cathedral in New York or the Empire State Building....I don't know if those are good examples but it's getting late. I'm sure I'll get pm's on this.
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Post by Curtis Kitto "MIKE" on May 5, 2008 5:20:28 GMT -5
Dear Cousin,
You captured the essence of the proposal's enormity.
Dgberg is ready to sell our heritage for welfare/poverty-level money or the price of a college education. (Dgberg: there are grants, loans, and scholarships available for the single mother to go to school.)
Just does not seem right to attempt to sell Paha Sapa so cheaply, does it?
Mike
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mona
Full Member
Posts: 128
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Post by mona on May 5, 2008 7:51:14 GMT -5
hello from crow creek band. Unfortunately, what happens is the older ones dont tell the younger generations anymore the stories and songs and history of the Kse Sapa. That our people used to take the bones of our relatives when they passed through, and bury them there. The Lakota creation story is from the Kse Sapa and Pte Oyate (buffalo nation). Our welcome back the thunder beings ceremony is done there...And to think seven generations ahead when you are making decisions. What would they have because we wanted a little money NOW. If the majority ever accepted, they wouldnt get very much, the lawyers and what the government would take, plus taxes, they would get a few dollars. My uncle was taken there long ago as he was sick and my grandma took him to hot springs and prayed for him there and put the water on his sickness.this was when they had no cars....so we need to tell the younger ones these thigs not just once but many times...
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